April 9, 2015
Back to my TCM today. My pulses were good. Like, good. Not, meh, good for me, but normal. My left side was a tad weaker, but after my acupuncture session he said it was nice and strong. I told him about my no herbs theory and he wasn't too keen on it. He said, if I had to choose between one or the other to do herbs. I reminded him how he said I always responded so well to acupuncture and he said yes, but that is a temporary fix, herbs build long term strength in my body. Read between the lines...a lifetime of taking them. Sigh. I did manage to get a discount on the herbs. $10 off, but hey, $10 off.
I'm toying with the idea of asking for a month long herb concoction (remember, I only do every other day so that's only a two week prescription) and just getting acupuncture when I go for a refill once a month. I really have to sit with this though because up until now, my uterus and ovaries have not only done well, but great. They are normal size and I can't help but credit adequate blood flow as part of the reason. So many woman with POF don't even have ovaries anymore. They can shrivel up like raisins. This, I want to avoid. My ultimate goal (of course is to get a nice plum egg out of them) but long term, to keep them healthy and producing hormone on their own.
It's funny. In the midst of all my moving forward on EA, I find I'm growing more and more certain of my own body being able to ovulate, conceive and carry. I really feel the Lord at work. My body has grown so much stronger just over the course of these past few weeks.
I also tried out a gym, and I have to say, I love it. I went two nights after I read my son stories for bedtime. I did a Zumba class and a pilates class. It was fun to meet up with my friend. It was a nice adult time out with a friend, which I think is so important and has been lacking in my life, but also great for my body. I really can't help but wonder if my problems are exacerbated by the fact, I'm not getting my heart pumping as much any more. Yes, I walk, chase my son, do little things here and there, but before he was born I worked out everyday for an hour. Usually hikes, brisk walks or some sort of dance type aerobics.
If I can get the blood pumping and work on more strength training, I think that will only be beneficial, not only to long term health but getting blood to my reproductive organs. It's an added expense every month, but I'm starting to feel a legitimate one that I need. Both physically, and emotionally. I get so stressed, so so stressed, and I find just working out really helps. I know that. I've always known that, but I know think the membership fee is well worth it. And, like I said, a bit of adult time with friends a few nights a week...so worth it. They've a kid's program there as well for $10 a month. Basically, it includes care for my son for two hours every day. Even if I just used that a few times a month, well worth the $10.
My sister-in-law text me with a bunch of questions about embryo adoption and I said I'd email her all about it, but I figured why not put it here. I'm sure a lot of people have questions. Here goes, my embryo adoption 101.
The term embryo adoption is a bit of a misnomer as it isn't a "technical adoption." To adopt, would mean it's a "life" and without getting into all the logistics and politics of it, some people are uncomfortable viewing it that way.
Aside from some double donor programs (there is a donor egg and donor sperm - one with extremely high success rates if you go this route is California Conceptions with a price tag of about $12,000 for three cycles, but most people qualify for a full refund if all three are unsuccessful) the embryos are not "created" for the people adopting or receiving the donor embryos. Most are left over from IVF cycles. Left over? Well, when people go through IVF there are normally some left over embryos. Example, a woman has 15 eggs retrieved. Maybe 13 fertilize. By day 3, perhaps 10 remain growing and there are 8 left by day 5. Most women have 1 or 2 embryos implanted. That means she would have 6 or 7 remaining. These are frozen.
If a couple decides they are done having children they have options. Leave the embryos on ice (which can get extremely expensive paying $700 or so a year to keep them frozen), donate them to science, destroy them or donate them. For many people, having strived for so long with fertility issues of their own, they can't fathom destroying their embryos so decide to bless a couple who cannot conceive with these potential little blessings.
There are several ways to pursue embryo adoption. One, you can hire an agency. This is most like a normal adoption. Potential donors can pick you as the adoptee. You must complete a home study as in traditional adoption. This is the most expensive route. Many agencies charge fees up to $8000 and when you add in home studies, legal documents, shipping and the fees for the FET (frozen embryo transfer) and medications, it ends up being the same price as many traditional adoptions. The bummer is, the federal tax credit does not apply in this case as it's not considered a true adoption.
Another method of pursuing embryo adoption is a private match. There are various websites out there where you an advertise you are looking and like above, a donating family can find you. Some of these too require home studies. You can also advertise in various forums and groups (I'm on one on Facebook) for potential matches. With this you would hire an attorney to do the legal paperwork, arrange for shipping of the embryos and do the transfer at the clinic of your choosing, or travel to the clinic the embryos are at. Some clinics however charge coordinating or administrative fees for using outside donors. One clinic, the one I met with charges more for the coordinating fee than the FET itself.
The last method of embryo adoption is more aptly coined embryo donation program. It is within the clinic itself. As people's storage comes due and they don't want to keep paying, they release the embryos to the clinic. Most are anonymous donations and go to the next person in line. Some people receiving embryos have certain criteria (a certain minority for example that they want.) Some donors I'm sure have criteria as well. I've seen some want certain religions for example.
The adopting couples do know some information about the donors. If open, you can get to know the couple as much as you want. Semi-open there is usually some degree of communication as well. For closed anonymous donation type scenarios, there is usually a stat sheet with the physical description, ethnic background and medical background of the donating couple as well as most times an embryology report that lists if there was genetic testing and the amount and grades of each of the embryos. The grading scale is too complex for me to go in here, but here's a website that breaks it down in case you want to learn more.
Here is a link to Day 3 grading. And, here is a link to Day 5 grading.
Some clinics prefer day 3, some day 5. It really depends on the clinic you choose and the health of the embryos. I briefly asked at the clinic I went to, and they said sometimes they prefer day 3 if the embryo is advanced and ready to break out of the shell. In that case, they transfer earlier to avoid it arresting before day 5. I've heard other people say their clinics wait through day 5 once it officially is a blastolyst because they think the more advanced it is in development, the stronger it is and it increases the likelihood of attaching and developing properly. The argument for day 5 is, you never know if a day 3 embryo will arrest by day 5 once in you. The flip side is, do they arrest because they aren't in the environment to grow. It all comes down to how much you trust your doctor to advise you.
Most times, assisted hatching is used before transfer. This is to ensure the embryo is able to break out of it's shell. I've read that freezing an embryo before it hatches can thicken the shell which is why a lot of clinics suggest using this technology. Other clinics ensure they are hatched before freezing thinking it optimizes the chances of a successful live birth after transfer. Again, find a doctor you can trust. The assisted hatching is a small laser cut in the shell. It's brief and precise and does not harm the embryo.
All off the above can be open, semi-open or closed adoptions. It is illegal to buy an embryo or request money for one. It IS legal to ask that the adopting family pay your legal fees, storage or transportation of the embryo. If anyone EVER asks you for money for their embryo report them.
Traditionally, EA IVF is cheaper than normal IVF. I say traditionally because if you go through an agency, you could end up paying more in fees. The procedure itself however is much cheaper. The reason is you are just doing a frozen embryo transfer. You do not have to stimulate the ovaries or have eggs retrieved and it requires far less monitoring. You are just doing the last step of what would be involved in the IVF cycle which is putting the embryo in.
There is however more prep with medications to prepare your body for transfer from what I understand because you are creating the environment to be ready for transfer which does require weekly monitoring to ensure your endometrial lining is the correct thickness. IVF cycles average about $12,400 according to the American Society of Reproductive Medicine. This fee does not include medications and there may be additional cost with ultra sounds, mock transfers and freezing and storing left over embryos.
A FET cycle seems to range between $3000-$5000. It's important to realize that this, as well as with IVF, does not always include everything like assisted hatching, mock transfers, consults, refreezing and it does not include any medications which can range from $1000-$3000 depending on what you need. Something else to keep in mind are the legal documents (some require you hire an attorney, some anonymous donations just require a notarized document saying you are accepting them.) Some clinics require FDA testing on the embryos, some don't unless it's donor egg or sperm. Some clinics don't include ultra sounds or pregnancy testing.
Ask a lot of questions regarding every kind of possible fee or out of pocket cost. If we do an EA through our clinic, procedures I anticipate will cost around $4200 with medications a few thousand on top of that. FDA testing would be anywhere between $400-$1000 from what I hear (if it hasn't been done) and depending on the situation if I have to hire a lawyer, or just do a notarized transfer, legal bills. For me, I'd also have to do a round of testing ahead of time, as you would with a traditional IVF of STD testing and thyroid functions to ensure the meds will be ok. This, I can have ordered through insurance, so the cost won't be as high as through a clinic. Still much cheaper than DE IVF (with a price tag between $20,000-$40,000) and traditional adoption around $25,000.
Is your head spinning yet? Mine sure was. There are a lot of great websites out there to learn more and answer your questions. If you ever consider it, please message me. I will add you to an outstanding support group to learn more on Facebook. I feel like I've learned far more through women's personal experiences than trying to navigate this alone.
As always, God Bless. Stay strong. Have faith. Always.
Back to my TCM today. My pulses were good. Like, good. Not, meh, good for me, but normal. My left side was a tad weaker, but after my acupuncture session he said it was nice and strong. I told him about my no herbs theory and he wasn't too keen on it. He said, if I had to choose between one or the other to do herbs. I reminded him how he said I always responded so well to acupuncture and he said yes, but that is a temporary fix, herbs build long term strength in my body. Read between the lines...a lifetime of taking them. Sigh. I did manage to get a discount on the herbs. $10 off, but hey, $10 off.
I'm toying with the idea of asking for a month long herb concoction (remember, I only do every other day so that's only a two week prescription) and just getting acupuncture when I go for a refill once a month. I really have to sit with this though because up until now, my uterus and ovaries have not only done well, but great. They are normal size and I can't help but credit adequate blood flow as part of the reason. So many woman with POF don't even have ovaries anymore. They can shrivel up like raisins. This, I want to avoid. My ultimate goal (of course is to get a nice plum egg out of them) but long term, to keep them healthy and producing hormone on their own.
It's funny. In the midst of all my moving forward on EA, I find I'm growing more and more certain of my own body being able to ovulate, conceive and carry. I really feel the Lord at work. My body has grown so much stronger just over the course of these past few weeks.
I also tried out a gym, and I have to say, I love it. I went two nights after I read my son stories for bedtime. I did a Zumba class and a pilates class. It was fun to meet up with my friend. It was a nice adult time out with a friend, which I think is so important and has been lacking in my life, but also great for my body. I really can't help but wonder if my problems are exacerbated by the fact, I'm not getting my heart pumping as much any more. Yes, I walk, chase my son, do little things here and there, but before he was born I worked out everyday for an hour. Usually hikes, brisk walks or some sort of dance type aerobics.
If I can get the blood pumping and work on more strength training, I think that will only be beneficial, not only to long term health but getting blood to my reproductive organs. It's an added expense every month, but I'm starting to feel a legitimate one that I need. Both physically, and emotionally. I get so stressed, so so stressed, and I find just working out really helps. I know that. I've always known that, but I know think the membership fee is well worth it. And, like I said, a bit of adult time with friends a few nights a week...so worth it. They've a kid's program there as well for $10 a month. Basically, it includes care for my son for two hours every day. Even if I just used that a few times a month, well worth the $10.
My sister-in-law text me with a bunch of questions about embryo adoption and I said I'd email her all about it, but I figured why not put it here. I'm sure a lot of people have questions. Here goes, my embryo adoption 101.
The term embryo adoption is a bit of a misnomer as it isn't a "technical adoption." To adopt, would mean it's a "life" and without getting into all the logistics and politics of it, some people are uncomfortable viewing it that way.
Aside from some double donor programs (there is a donor egg and donor sperm - one with extremely high success rates if you go this route is California Conceptions with a price tag of about $12,000 for three cycles, but most people qualify for a full refund if all three are unsuccessful) the embryos are not "created" for the people adopting or receiving the donor embryos. Most are left over from IVF cycles. Left over? Well, when people go through IVF there are normally some left over embryos. Example, a woman has 15 eggs retrieved. Maybe 13 fertilize. By day 3, perhaps 10 remain growing and there are 8 left by day 5. Most women have 1 or 2 embryos implanted. That means she would have 6 or 7 remaining. These are frozen.
If a couple decides they are done having children they have options. Leave the embryos on ice (which can get extremely expensive paying $700 or so a year to keep them frozen), donate them to science, destroy them or donate them. For many people, having strived for so long with fertility issues of their own, they can't fathom destroying their embryos so decide to bless a couple who cannot conceive with these potential little blessings.
There are several ways to pursue embryo adoption. One, you can hire an agency. This is most like a normal adoption. Potential donors can pick you as the adoptee. You must complete a home study as in traditional adoption. This is the most expensive route. Many agencies charge fees up to $8000 and when you add in home studies, legal documents, shipping and the fees for the FET (frozen embryo transfer) and medications, it ends up being the same price as many traditional adoptions. The bummer is, the federal tax credit does not apply in this case as it's not considered a true adoption.
Another method of pursuing embryo adoption is a private match. There are various websites out there where you an advertise you are looking and like above, a donating family can find you. Some of these too require home studies. You can also advertise in various forums and groups (I'm on one on Facebook) for potential matches. With this you would hire an attorney to do the legal paperwork, arrange for shipping of the embryos and do the transfer at the clinic of your choosing, or travel to the clinic the embryos are at. Some clinics however charge coordinating or administrative fees for using outside donors. One clinic, the one I met with charges more for the coordinating fee than the FET itself.
The last method of embryo adoption is more aptly coined embryo donation program. It is within the clinic itself. As people's storage comes due and they don't want to keep paying, they release the embryos to the clinic. Most are anonymous donations and go to the next person in line. Some people receiving embryos have certain criteria (a certain minority for example that they want.) Some donors I'm sure have criteria as well. I've seen some want certain religions for example.
The adopting couples do know some information about the donors. If open, you can get to know the couple as much as you want. Semi-open there is usually some degree of communication as well. For closed anonymous donation type scenarios, there is usually a stat sheet with the physical description, ethnic background and medical background of the donating couple as well as most times an embryology report that lists if there was genetic testing and the amount and grades of each of the embryos. The grading scale is too complex for me to go in here, but here's a website that breaks it down in case you want to learn more.
Here is a link to Day 3 grading. And, here is a link to Day 5 grading.
Some clinics prefer day 3, some day 5. It really depends on the clinic you choose and the health of the embryos. I briefly asked at the clinic I went to, and they said sometimes they prefer day 3 if the embryo is advanced and ready to break out of the shell. In that case, they transfer earlier to avoid it arresting before day 5. I've heard other people say their clinics wait through day 5 once it officially is a blastolyst because they think the more advanced it is in development, the stronger it is and it increases the likelihood of attaching and developing properly. The argument for day 5 is, you never know if a day 3 embryo will arrest by day 5 once in you. The flip side is, do they arrest because they aren't in the environment to grow. It all comes down to how much you trust your doctor to advise you.
Most times, assisted hatching is used before transfer. This is to ensure the embryo is able to break out of it's shell. I've read that freezing an embryo before it hatches can thicken the shell which is why a lot of clinics suggest using this technology. Other clinics ensure they are hatched before freezing thinking it optimizes the chances of a successful live birth after transfer. Again, find a doctor you can trust. The assisted hatching is a small laser cut in the shell. It's brief and precise and does not harm the embryo.
All off the above can be open, semi-open or closed adoptions. It is illegal to buy an embryo or request money for one. It IS legal to ask that the adopting family pay your legal fees, storage or transportation of the embryo. If anyone EVER asks you for money for their embryo report them.
Traditionally, EA IVF is cheaper than normal IVF. I say traditionally because if you go through an agency, you could end up paying more in fees. The procedure itself however is much cheaper. The reason is you are just doing a frozen embryo transfer. You do not have to stimulate the ovaries or have eggs retrieved and it requires far less monitoring. You are just doing the last step of what would be involved in the IVF cycle which is putting the embryo in.
There is however more prep with medications to prepare your body for transfer from what I understand because you are creating the environment to be ready for transfer which does require weekly monitoring to ensure your endometrial lining is the correct thickness. IVF cycles average about $12,400 according to the American Society of Reproductive Medicine. This fee does not include medications and there may be additional cost with ultra sounds, mock transfers and freezing and storing left over embryos.
A FET cycle seems to range between $3000-$5000. It's important to realize that this, as well as with IVF, does not always include everything like assisted hatching, mock transfers, consults, refreezing and it does not include any medications which can range from $1000-$3000 depending on what you need. Something else to keep in mind are the legal documents (some require you hire an attorney, some anonymous donations just require a notarized document saying you are accepting them.) Some clinics require FDA testing on the embryos, some don't unless it's donor egg or sperm. Some clinics don't include ultra sounds or pregnancy testing.
Ask a lot of questions regarding every kind of possible fee or out of pocket cost. If we do an EA through our clinic, procedures I anticipate will cost around $4200 with medications a few thousand on top of that. FDA testing would be anywhere between $400-$1000 from what I hear (if it hasn't been done) and depending on the situation if I have to hire a lawyer, or just do a notarized transfer, legal bills. For me, I'd also have to do a round of testing ahead of time, as you would with a traditional IVF of STD testing and thyroid functions to ensure the meds will be ok. This, I can have ordered through insurance, so the cost won't be as high as through a clinic. Still much cheaper than DE IVF (with a price tag between $20,000-$40,000) and traditional adoption around $25,000.
Is your head spinning yet? Mine sure was. There are a lot of great websites out there to learn more and answer your questions. If you ever consider it, please message me. I will add you to an outstanding support group to learn more on Facebook. I feel like I've learned far more through women's personal experiences than trying to navigate this alone.
As always, God Bless. Stay strong. Have faith. Always.
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